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think im getting the 19 " speedlines for my car , talking to a guy today who said not to , he says the megane does every thing better on the 18 " wheels, any one changed and noticed a difference in the cars handling ?? cheers guys
ps the guy does tyre testing for one of the big manufactures so knows his onions !!
 

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want to know how good time they will be able to do on 18" as if the time on 18 will be better (who knows...), sales will be loosing another argument why to ask additional 1,300 eur (over here) for optional 19...
 

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I just don't get that people actually think Renault would purposely try to break a record with equipment that is "slow". Be that 19" wheels that "don't handle as well as the 18s" or on the RE050As that are only used because "they got a job lot on the cheap".

It is most perplexing.
 

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its quiet same story as with the BMW 1M & M3, the new 1M is in straight line so fast as the M3 (from what I read and saw tests of 0-100 sprints, etc...), but BMW cant officially confirm that something what’s in smaller class and 20K cheaper is faster...

R.S. division cant say, that they manufactured wheels which are nice + extra cost, but your Meg never will be so fast with them as on 18" - i am not saying it sure be light that, but why than F1 cars (and not just those in motorsport) are not using something with 15 or 20" profile ??? instead of that huges baloons which they are wearing ?

please i am not telling the 18" are sure faster, just want to see the result 18" vs. 19" in exactly same condition...
 

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R.S. division cant say, that they manufactured wheels which are nice + extra cost, but your Meg never will be so fast with them as on 18" - i am not saying it sure be light that, but why than F1 cars (and not just those in motorsport) are not using something with 15 or 20" profile ??? instead of that huges baloons which they are wearing ?

please i am not telling the 18" are sure faster, just want to see the result 18" vs. 19" in exactly same condition...
If the 18" wheels were the 'faster' option for the lap record - then the car would have had them. As you say, why recreate the existing 19" wheels if the 18" are faster? F1 cars have big tyres, as the tyres are a very large part of the suspension qualities of an F1 car....
 

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If the 18" wheels were the 'faster' option for the lap record - then the car would have had them. As you say, why recreate the existing 19" wheels if the 18" are faster? F1 cars have big tyres, as the tyres are a very large part of the suspension qualities of an F1 car....
don’t think so, once they will be faster just for half second (if ever) Renault will be running on 19" anyway, to support sales of their optional 19" wheels, it’s not just about record (once there isn’t any FWD car around - in ring lap records list) but also to support sales, from what i know.

why to recreate 19 ? because market is asking for them and they can do additional profit on them, don’t think the different in price between 18 and 19 is 1300/4 = 325 eur per wheel, or do you think so ? just read there is sold over 12,000 RS250 if just half of them (maybe more) is running 19 instead of 18 they made profit of 7,800,000 of EURO just on wheels, once the manufacture price of 18 & 19 will be same ! what’s sure not, even if there is different of half of that, they did profit 4,000,000 eur just because the 19" are "faster"

If the point with F1 tires will be like you are talking than there still be just small piece of rubber and BIG piece of wheel, what’s isn’t, because the rubber need also some space to “work”

Again I am not saying the 18” are 100% sure faster around the ring, but it’s worth to loose split a second, once they help you to do “few” another millions extra profit on car ;)
 

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are the 19's lighter than the 18's?
if not how is it making the car faster?


I agree with Brano it is all down to selling a product, Renault have the 19's anyway and painting them black (like many other people have done ages ago and 99% of people say look much better) is a easy option and they can still sell the upgrade.

No doubt the car could have gone faster with some lightweight wheels like pro race or compomotive but why do this as it would invole a big cost in tooling and the car would break the record anyway.

on the road I would not have though you would be able to notice the difference in wheel size except for the harder ride
 

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i was also thinking about the weight, but as i dont know the weight of 18 vs. 19 wasnt starting that (but was expecting 18 are lighter), unsprung weight can help a lot :)
 

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Do the people claiming against Carl's statement that the 19's are faster happen to have 18's on their cars?

To think otherwise is absolute nonsense; Renaultsport's ring efforts are deadly serious - if it would have been faster on 18's it would have been on 18's.
 

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don’t think so, once they will be faster just for half second (if ever) Renault will be running on 19" anyway, to support sales of their optional 19" wheels, it’s not just about record (once there isn’t any FWD car around - in ring lap records list) but also to support sales, from what i know.

why to recreate 19 ? because market is asking for them and they can do additional profit on them, don’t think the different in price between 18 and 19 is 1300/4 = 325 eur per wheel, or do you think so ? just read there is sold over 12,000 RS250 if just half of them (maybe more) is running 19 instead of 18 they made profit of 7,800,000 of EURO just on wheels, once the manufacture price of 18 & 19 will be same ! what’s sure not, even if there is different of half of that, they did profit 4,000,000 eur just because the 19" are "faster"

If the point with F1 tires will be like you are talking than there still be just small piece of rubber and BIG piece of wheel, what’s isn’t, because the rubber need also some space to “work”

Again I am not saying the 18” are 100% sure faster around the ring, but it’s worth to loose split a second, once they help you to do “few” another millions extra profit on car ;)
I give up!!!

19" alloys are standard fitment on the Trophy, if we wanted to make more money - I would have put 18" alloys as standard on it and then charged for the 19" alloys and Bridgestones. I didnt choose to do that, but offer the car in the same 'tune' as it was when it broke the record.

19" alloys are an option on the 250 today and will be an option on the 265 in April - 18" alloys will continue to be standard (IIRC a std alloy on a Golf GTI is 17"...) Some people dont want / like 19" alloys and prefer the 18" wheels, others prefer the looks of the 19" wheel and are happy to pay the extra for them.

Thanks for the lesson on profit (your figures are way out BTW), but I kinda know how it works...
 

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I give up!!!

19" alloys are standard fitment on the Trophy, if we wanted to make more money - I would have put 18" alloys as standard on it and then charged for the 19" alloys and Bridgestones. I didnt choose to do that, but offer the car in the same 'tune' as it was when it broke the record.

19" alloys are an option on the 250 today and will be an option on the 265 in April - 18" alloys will continue to be standard (IIRC a std alloy on a Golf GTI is 17"...) Some people dont want / like 19" alloys and prefer the 18" wheels, others prefer the looks of the 19" wheel and are happy to pay the extra for them.

Thanks for the lesson on profit (your figures are way out BTW), but I kinda know how it works...
Hows possible that I saw 265 on 18" over here than ? dont think they are standard everywhere ?

OK but thats just 500 oh sorry 1,000 cars, rest of the 250 owners have to pay for the 19".

I know that my numbers in "calculation" on profit are not right (just was expessing the basic math), but please dont tell me you are not doing better profit on them compare to 18 ?

Do you have exact weight for the 18 as also for 19 from part cataloque ?
 

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This is a stupid argument! I think you guys should give Carl a rest, I think it's excellent that we have someone from Renault contributing on this site!

I have 18's. I can say with full confidence that on either 18's or 19's, it wouldn't get within 2 minutes of the record time so it doesn't make a blind bit of difference to me! :)
 

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If the 18" wheels were the 'faster' option for the lap record - then the car would have had them. As you say, why recreate the existing 19" wheels if the 18" are faster?
I'm not arguing that the 18's are faster. But I'm afraid your argument doesn't settle the question.

IMO, the 265 is simply good enough to beat the R26.R on that track comfortably, without needing to tweak it to the last detail. Hell, I even thing a 250 would beat that record (but that would make the .R look bad). Add to that the lack of real competition (you beat your own record), and you don't need to put much effort into breaking the record or setting an untouchable record.

That's when you can start making concessions to marketing. Commercially, does it make more sense to have the 250 or a special edition Trophy beat the record? The latter. Does it make more sense to fit it with 18's or more expensive 19's with debatable looks (that most likely aren't selling that well)? The latter (and paint them black to hide the debatable looks). Does it make any sense to make a big thing of having Bridgestone tyres fitted (which could have been fitted to the 250 anyway), taking merit from away from the car? Not unless there are commercial reasons behind it.

Now, if Renault starts facing some real competition, there will be no room for marketing concessions. It would be interesting to see Renault choices in that case.

* In Portugal the 19's and Recaros are on the same pack. I passed on the Recaros because of the 19's and I know two guys who paid for the pack and then some extra to have the 18's instead of the 19's.
 

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I'm not arguing that the 18's are faster. But I'm afraid your argument doesn't settle the question.

IMO, the 265 is simply good enough to beat the R26.R on that track comfortably, without needing to tweak it to the last detail. Hell, I even thing a 250 would beat that record (but that would make the .R look bad). Add to that the lack of real competition (you beat your own record), and you don't need to put much effort into breaking the record or setting an untouchable record.

That's when you can start making concessions to marketing. Commercially, does it make more sense to have the 250 or a special edition Trophy beat the record? The latter. Does it make more sense to fit it with 18's or more expensive 19's with debatable looks (that most likely aren't selling that well)? The latter (and paint them black to hide the debatable looks). Does it make any sense to make a big thing of having Bridgestone tyres fitted (which could have been fitted to the 250 anyway), taking merit from away from the car? Not unless there are commercial reasons behind it.

Now, if Renault starts facing some real competition, there will be no room for marketing concessions. It would be interesting to see Renault choices in that case.

* In Portugal the 19's and Recaros are on the same pack. I passed on the Recaros because of the 19's and I know two guys who paid for the pack and then some extra to have the 18's instead of the 19's.
The mix of 19" alloys in the UK is actually quite high. . The car was tried on many different tyres, but the test driver who set the lap record prefered the Bridgestones (and they were the quickest). There were no marketing concessions on the specification of the Trophy 265, but as no one wants to believe or hear the truth I will step out now and leave you to it.

The RS400 will run on 22" spinners BTW ....
 

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Hows possible that I saw 265 on 18" over here than ? dont think they are standard everywhere ?

OK but thats just 500 oh sorry 1,000 cars, rest of the 250 owners have to pay for the 19".

I know that my numbers in "calculation" on profit are not right (just was expessing the basic math), but please dont tell me you are not doing better profit on them compare to 18 ?

Do you have exact weight for the 18 as also for 19 from part cataloque ?
I think all countries chose to the put the 19" alloys as standard (as they came with the Bridgestone tyres), but we had the option to fit the 18" Cup alloys (with the 'normal' Cup tyres).

I dont have the weight difference to hand, but I will try and find out for you...
 

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Do the people claiming against Carl's statement that the 19's are faster happen to have 18's on their cars?

To think otherwise is absolute nonsense; Renaultsport's ring efforts are deadly serious - if it would have been faster on 18's it would have been on 18's.
The ring record was for "production vehicle record" I read this as "how a customer buys it". The Trophy has 19s as standard fit because the trend is for large wheels and it helps Renault marketing dept. justify the additional cost.

If you look at some of the Porsche RSR & GT class cars they don't have large diameter wheels on them to make em any quicker - instead they have smaller wheels (same as F1) to save weight. It's weight that kills performance on track...
 
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